Who would you believe.??

[Suzie_Homemaker]

Q. If other children are present in the home accompanied by their OWN parent ( providers child’s friend visiting if parent stays, family member visiting with their child, parent and child coming for an interview, etc.) do those children count in the providers numbers?
A. Yes. All children on the premises count in your numbers.

Same here too.

Children of house guest count. Own children's play dates after school or in summer count. And so do client interview children. This why I schedule interview for immediately after day care or in nap if not all children in that day.

[bright sparks]

We also have this if sibling with mom at pick up/drop off. We have to explain that they count, that this our livelihood and we must not risk being closed down and so sibling must stay in car or parent and child remain on doorstep for us to get coat and shoe on child who here.

It is illegal to leave a child alone in a car in Ontario. It is neglect! This is some major BS right there! I am so happy that I'm not going to work with this nonsense. It does a big fat zero to make children safer

[Suzie_Homemaker]

It is illegal to leave a child alone in a car in Ontario. It is neglect!

I have long drive and parent park right next to front door, maybe 6 feet away from door. I think if parent was leaving child in car to go into store or even on main road would be different. I not sure if it illegal here or not when parent in such close proximity. No different really than strapping child in car seat while they brush snow off car in Winter.

Add - Found this. It say only Quebec is age for leaving child in car which must be 7. Nothing for Ontario. Page 3 has table.

http://cwrp.ca/sites/default/files/p...ns/en/144e.pdf

[babydom]

I know it's so frustrating!! I just don't know who to believe. U write one thing but then tell me another on the phone...urgh!!!!

[Suzie_Homemaker]

I think, where there is a risk of fine with Bill 10, it best to be over cautious.

I would avoid inside playdate, explain to client their children are counted in ratios even if for few short minutes at drop off/pick up, and then when it been in effect for little while, things might be clearer. Always uncertainty when reg change until initial issue sorted out.

[kindertime]

The only way to regulate home daycares effectively is to license them as individuals and independently. ~ and visit them regularly to make sure they are sticking to the rules ongoing.

What you are describing is what we have here, minus the subsidy part. I completely understand why you are saying this, and I agree, but the reality of this kind of a plan would likely be worse for a lot of you than it is now. In order to be visited, there has to be someone to do the visiting. A person with their own opinions and beliefs. The daycare providers won't get to pick who that is, so what if the person doing that job, doesn't like you? What if s/he doesn't like daycares in basements, or doesn't like the way you have your play spaces arranged? There is usually a lot of room for interpretation and misunderstanding in rules and laws. (That's why the lawyers get paid the big bucks!)

In my area, we have a great office for our support, but in some of them, holy cow! I feel really sorry for a lot of the providers and what they have to put up with. For example, the provider was going to lose her licence because the windows of the basement were 1 inch too high on the wall, according to the person doing the inspection. There are stories of the inspectors going into the provider's bedroom and rifling through the dresser drawers. These were the types of situations where the provider had no recourse. There was no one to turn to. Then we unionized. And that just opened up a whole other kettle of fish!

What you are suggesting, makes sense, on paper, but when people are involved, things just get more and more complicated. You would lose more and more of the freedom you want and in the end, the people who want to do something illegal, will still do it! Like I posted yesterday, daycare fraud is a very big business in Que. and we have to most structured system in the country.

[playfelt]

I plan to use common sense and would like to think that the inspectors will too in the sense that a parent standing in my doorway with a school age child or infant in sitter while dressing other child is best and safest for everyone but for sure will not be allowing the other child to enter into the playroom or run around the back yard at pick up they will be glued to mom for the 5 minutes they are here. I won't be doing playdates, etc. I interview in the evenings anyways and will only allow a parent and infant to come again for a few minutes for the purpose of dropping off the forms and meeting the other children in care but not staying to play. It means we will need to have an empty space for a couple of weeks or the new child will need to start daycare cold turkey which truthfully has always worked out fine for me. I always consider integration as something the parent needs not the child.

[bright sparks]

What you are describing is what we have here, minus the subsidy part. I completely understand why you are saying this, and I agree, but the reality of this kind of a plan would likely be worse for a lot of you than it is now. In order to be visited, there has to be someone to do the visiting. A person with their own opinions and beliefs. The daycare providers won't get to pick who that is, so what if the person doing that job, doesn't like you? What if s/he doesn't like daycares in basements, or doesn't like the way you have your play spaces arranged? There is usually a lot of room for interpretation and misunderstanding in rules and laws. (That's why the lawyers get paid the big bucks!)

In my area, we have a great office for our support, but in some of them, holy cow! I feel really sorry for a lot of the providers and what they have to put up with. For example, the provider was going to lose her licence because the windows of the basement were 1 inch too high on the wall, according to the person doing the inspection. There are stories of the inspectors going into the provider's bedroom and rifling through the dresser drawers. These were the types of situations where the provider had no recourse. There was no one to turn to. Then we unionized. And that just opened up a whole other kettle of fish!

What you are suggesting, makes sense, on paper, but when people are involved, things just get more and more complicated. You would lose more and more of the freedom you want and in the end, the people who want to do something illegal, will still do it! Like I posted yesterday, daycare fraud is a very big business in Que. and we have to most structured system in the country.

I'm coming from a country where home based childcare is heavily regulated by the government requiring mandatory training and regular government inspectors coming into the home and guess what, it works. There is no room for opinion. There are a set of standards for all, and the inspectors follow the same framework where it's irrelevant what their opinions and preferences are for. You need your home checked before you can even open so no worry over being closed down because you wouldn't be open in the first place. The system works and I'm sure there are flaws, nothing is perfect, but it certainly focus' more on child safety than Bill 10 claims too. There is no subsidiary either. Low income families would just get a greater tax credit per month similar to CCTB. Additionally the system supports and offers resources to the childcare providers. Should changes need to be made to a providers premises or property, there are grants and funding options. They are also faced with strict age ratios. As I said it is heavily regulated and it works for them. I'm qualified to provide care in this system and my husband is also which would allow us to have more children as long as square footage was sufficient. Children are also never allowed to be left with an assistant or family member or friend even in an emergency unless they are a licensed childcare provider, hence why my husband did the required training too.

[innisfildaycare]

Ok no offense to anyone, but I think maybe some of us are extremely sensitive! I understand the fines, and $250,000 fine and so forth.. But to really believe you would be fined for having a parent pick up their child with another child in their care is absolutely ridulous! Yes, I understand everyone needs and wants to be cautious but this is beyond cautious! So, if a girl guide come to my door with her mother selling cookies and I ask them to come in wand wait in the foyer while I gather some money to purchase te cookies, I will be fined?? Ludicrous!! I don't believe it and I don't believe I or anyone would be fined for that or for any other children accompanied by their parents at pick up time! The only thing I will stress about is making sure I follow with age requirements and max 5 kids. I think that is what their really looking into and fining for....the rest is just scare tactics.. Which seem to be working!!

[Van]

In BC if the Parent is with the child you do not count the child in your numbers
you are looking after your daycare children and the parent is looking after her child